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Think somebody can guess or accidentally get your seed phrase? Nope, and I’ll prove it with free money.

I see quite a few posts/comments regularly from people wondering if a 24 word seed phrase can be guessed, hacked, brute forced, etc. So here’s a simple proposition: **I’ll give you a chance at free money.**

Don’t believe me? Here’s the challenge…

**I’ve deposited 10,000 sats into a wallet. You get to guess the seed phrase.**

To make it even easier, **I’m going to give you ALL of the words.**

That’s right, I’m literally going to give you ALL of the seed words, in random order, for your guessing pleasure.

**Here they are:**

chalk mimic crane marriage oxygen hood million clerk demand effort grid afford floor force december immense damp toss assume present retire cream clinic gown

All 24 of them right there.

But there’s not actually BTC in there right? **WRONG**.

Go ahead and check the balance [HERE](https://www.blockonomics.co/#/search?q=zpub6s87mnPqX9jT5bWvKFz6ZLCrhQsPh275BXx45a9kRuXUYbcxhLYZCpzyP2TpuEWte9mDYMprJv6QwNtCd7D64PAQMj4kSdu1WSZRQL3exyk)

You’ve even got the zpub there to see all addresses for the wallet.

I’m not shitting you. The words are there. The free BTC is there.

Just go and get it right? RIGHT?

————————————————–

**Now, if you want to find out why you’re going to fail miserably at this, keep reading…**

Why is it near (and I mean neeeaaarrr) impossible for someone to be randomly assigned your words, or to be guessed by somebody else?

To find out, let’s start with a worst case scenario, a head start if you will: **Somebody knows all of your 24 words, but not the exact order of them.**

You might think that’s an INSANE advantage right? Let’s see…

To find out how many ways you can order 24 words, we can use a factorial. A factorial is simply multiplying a number by all of the numbers below it, denoted by a “!” after the number.

4! = 4 x 3 x 2 x 1 = 24

So what’s the factorial of 24?…

24! = 24 x 23 x 22 x 21… = **~620,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.**

That is **620 sextillion unique ways to order 24 words.**

To put that into perspective, the average high end gaming computer has a clock speed of 4GHz, meaning it can make 4 billion calculations per second.

620 sextillion / 4 billion = 155 trillion seconds.

155 trillion seconds / 60 / 60 / 24 / 365 = **4,915,017 years to find all permutations using a modern gaming PC.**

Unless they’ve got a quantum super-computer, nobody will simply guess, stumble upon, or brute force your seed phrase. **And this is knowing ALL of the words to begin with.**

Hell, even *with* a super computer it’ll still take years to find.

If you don’t know every single word for the phrase, go ahead and **multiply that number by 2,048!**.

Those are the REAL odds you have to worry about.

**TL;DR: You’re screwed. Bwahahahahahahahahaha**



View Reddit by PizzaOnTheRoof556View Source

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34 Comments

  1. Correction: to calculate the odds without knowing the seed words, you don’t multiple that number by 2048. You use 2048! (divided by 2048-24). It’s a MUCH bigger number.

  2. > I’ve deposited 10,000 sats into a wallet

    I mean I’m not trying to change the subject here but you haven’t really created much enticement here… Charlie Lee put up an equivalent $1 million USD bounty to prove Segwit was safe… You’ve only put up $5 :shrug:

  3. A cool design feature of the BIP-39 word list is that you only need the 4 first letters of each word (or less if the word is shorter) to identify each word uniquely.

    So OP seed words can be written as:

    > chal mimi cran marr oxyg hood mill cler dema effo grid affo floo forc dece imme damp toss assu pres reti crea clin gown

  4. Knowing that ‘pizza’ is one of the standard seed phrase words, I wondered if anyone would be dumb enough to keep a balance in ‘pizza * 12’ or ‘pizza * 24’

    The answer: No. No one was that dumb.

  5. I wonder if something could be done with the fact that

    * one of these 11-bit numbers ends with 8 bits of checksum, and
    * another might start with some kind of version number (if the wallet that generated it was Electrum).

    But I can’t really think of anything.

  6. So it would be actually much simpler to write down your seed phrase in plain sight but in random order, and you only need to remember the order 🤔, unless you are really unlucky and someone guesses the seed phrase, which can also affect you if you don’t publicize your seed phrase😒.

  7. There is a tiny mistake in your logic. Not big enough to change the outcome of your “experiment”, but still to be considered:

    I´m guessing you shuffeled the words by yourself meaning they are not truly randomized. That reduced the entropy by a little.

  8. It seems like you are saying that it really doesn’t matter if you save your seed phrase on a computer or phone (which people on here are usually massively against) provided that the words are just not in correct order

  9. So, let’s just get 5,000,000 gaming PC’s working together, and we’ll have those Sats in a year or less.

    *enters query into dark web Google:* “how to create a bot net”

What do you think?

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